Feed isues with Model 12

[97th SIgnalman]

I have a Remington Model 12C that I took to the range for the first time yesterday. Accuracy is great but I has some minor feed issues. When I loaded Remington Standard Velocity LR ammo (Green and light blue box) I get some rounds that hang up at the edge of the chamber mouth and won't feed unless I back off the slide a bit an shove it home again which also nicks up the bullet nose. When I use Federal standard velocity LR ammo everything is perfect.

I think that I will reserve the Remmington (only about 3 boxes left) for my Buckmark pistol where it works fine. I still have nine boxes of the Federal and that is what I will use in the Model 12 where it works perfectly.

Has anyone ever had similar feeding issues? Is there something that I should look for? (other than more Federal ammo)

[97th SIgnalman]

I have only used WW Wildcats and the old Imperial hollowpoints. Both fed very well in my three 12's.

I wonder if the ones that hang up for you may have the flat nose profile that alot of Rem brand ammo has. That may be enough to cause the hang up where a more common round nose profile which the gun would have been designed around feeds easier.
Just a thought.

I'll check that out. Thanks.

[Dave]

In the past, I've had the same problem you are having with a few mod. 12's. While it's true that the problem could be flat nose bullets it has been my experience that most mod. 12's will feed them. Most of the time it is gunk built up in the slot that the rim of the case slides into on the bolt face. A good cleaning will fix that problem. If it still doesn't feed after a good cleaning of the bolt try round nose bullets. If it still doesn't feed the chances are the slot the case rim rides up in on the bolt face is well worn. I have had to change a number of bolts to solve your problem over the years.
HTH
Dave

[97th SIgnalman]

On the suggestion regarding bullet nose issues I checked the Good feeding Federals against the rough feeding Remington ammo. Actually, the Remington looks better with a somewhat more pointed and polished nose with a coating of a slick black lube. The federal ammo is the more blunt of the two with a rougher finish and no apparent lube. Based on appearence you would think that the Remington would feed better than the Federal but the reverse is true.

I measured the rounds from each brand with a digital caliper and the OAL lengths are the same. The two rim thicknesses are equal as well.

I scrubbed the bolt face super clean before I shot the rifle and the bolt face and rim groove looked "OK". However, I don't really know what I am looking for.

[97th SIgnalman]

I spent some more time looking at the bolt face and watching a slow feed process. The main resistance to the cartridge rising up into the grooves on the bolt face comes from the extractor as it drags on the edge of the shell casing just above the rim. The edge of the extractor at its lower shoulder where it first contacts the shell being fed is pretty sharp. It actually carves a fairly pronounced groove into the shell casing just above the rim. I wonder if it might help if I were to stone that initial contact cornner on the extractor. That way that it could cam itself more smoothly as it swings out over the shell casing and and thereby offer less resistance to the upward motion of the shell as it is raised by the elevator or follower...just a thought.

However, that wouldn't account for the difference between the slick feeding Federal ammo and the rough feeding Remington stuff. Maybe the Remington brass is softer which would allow the extractor to dig into the shell cassing more deeply. That is obviously pure conjecture on my part but I have no other explanaton.

[97th SIgnalman]

Is it possible there is a bunch of grease packed in behind the extractor which makes it not want to slide over the rim?

Is the extractor damaged?

Noel,
The extractor and its spring have been cleaned and oiled and seem to move freely with the spring itself providing the primary resistance. I can move it with my finger with what seems to be ordinary effort. The edge of the extractor looks to be sharp and free of nicks and chips. If anything, it may be too sharp given how it tends to scratch the shell case just above the rim.

As I see it, in normal operation the carrier lifts the cartridge up into the bolt groove and slides it in behind the extractor. The only time the extractor actually has so slip over the cartridge rim is when you manually load a single round into the chamber and then close the bolt over the loaded chamber. Or at least that is how it seems to me. If you have a different view of the loading cycle then tell me how you see it working. I am new to this particular rifle and I would value the opinion of someone with more experience on Model 12's.

Thanks for your input.

[97th SIgnalman]

The failure to feed comes any stage of magazine loading from ten rounds down to the last round but only with the Remington Standard velicity ammo. However, as I said above it functions perfectly with Federal standard velocity ammo...every round all the time. Gee, you would think that a Remington rifle would like remington ammo.

[Dave]

Signalman,
My advice is to stick with the Federal ammo. As the good old model 12's get older they seem to be a bit more finicky as to what they will feed. After all, these guns are getting old. Also 22's are shot more than high power rifles. I can't tell you how many times I have gone to the range and shot a brick of 22's while at the same time only shot a box of high power rounds. Like many other 22's some ammo works better than others. Changes in production techniques, bullet design, etc. over the years probably have a lot to do with new Remington ammo not working well. I'm quite sure that Rem. ammo will run through new Rem. firearms very well for the most part these days.At least, that's been my experiance. That said, ware is likely a factor. I would look to see if your extractor has a bur on the case rim side. If your rifle was fed single shot a lot, it's not impossible that there is a bur there. Be careful if you try to stone a bur there though, a little change could make a lot of difference, for the worst, on an extractor. Also, the feed groove in the bolt should be fairly uniformed. If it shows rounded edges or a bulge in the width of the groove that could be the ware your looking for. Like I said, I think I would stick to ammo that works. Finding a bolt that's in better shape than yours (yours still feeds with Fed. ammo) may not be so easy. Over the years I've seen a lot of feeding problems with mod. 12's (my father collected them for 40 years and we've had hundreds of them go through our hands) and it was either dirt and grime or ware that caused the problems.
HTH
Dave

[97th SIgnalman]

Thanks Dave. I will stick with the Federal fodder for my Model 12. I will look closely at the bolt face feed grooves (for wear) and the edges of the extractor (for burrs).