Identifying a Remington Rolling Block - Possible Early Model 1 1/2?

[marlinman93]

I'll have to look through all my Remington resources to see which mentioned the Winchester relationship. Jerry Landskron's book on Remington pistols has the finest history of the family and company from beginnings to much later. He mentions that a contract with Egypt caused financial difficulties when some Arab Shiek required Remington to pay him .50 cents per rifle before they would pay the contract. He also mentions Remington often ran into similar difficulties when dealing with foreign governments and individuals requiring kickbacks to persons before contracts were paid.
In March 1886 Remington did sell the typewriter division to Wycoff, Seamans, & Benedict for $186,000. That only paid off some of their debt, and the remaining creditors demanded payment. There was a huge contract pending with Turkey that the company hoped would be their salvation, but it was lost to Mauser, and the group overseeing Remington's possible receivership at that time finally gave in and declared bankruptcy. It took two more years for the plant to be sold, and four more after that before it all finalized and the receiver committee finished their involvement. The company was purchased through the court for $200,000. The assets were listed as $1,711,784 and liabilities at $1,255,703. Seems the $200,000 compared to the $450,000 difference was quite a bargain for the buyers.
It's reported that Philo Remington actively helped the new owners in transitioning the company and trying to make it all go well. But during the transition process it seems to have taken a toll on Philo and he died during the changeover.

[wlw-19958]

Hi There,

I will have to obtain a copy of that book. I am interested in
that period of time and the more info I can get, the better.

According to George Layman, Remington did have trouble
collecting from the Egyptians. The U.S. State Dept. intervened
and 1877 secured payments for all rifles delivered and for the
ones stored in the London warehouse.

These payments didn't cover rifles completed or still in the
process of manufacture held by the Factory but apparently
these too were eventually paid for by 1880.

Although Remington had a lot of trouble with Egypt, they did
get their money from the Egyptians before the bankruptcy. I
think the "Egyptian Trouble" was a convenient scapegoat for
the Remington brothers incompetence in running their father's
Company.

Cheers!
Webb

[marlinman93]

I agree. I doubt the .50 cents per rifle paid to some sheik caused them to lose money. It might have reduced profits, but surely not enough to hurt them.
Eliphat Remington Jr. was more dedicated to the town and workers than he was to the company, and that caused him issues making financial decisions he felt were better for the community vs. better for Remington. He also kept men on doing make work projects when firearms sales got slow, rather than lay them off until sales picked up. I think he had a soft heart, and that's not a good recipe for success in running a company.

You'll really enjoy Jerry Landskron's Remington pistol book if you buy a copy. It's got more history in it than any treatise I've read on the company. Supposedly it's almost all based on talking with a very old gentleman who worked at Remington his whole life and retired from there. He knew the brothers well, and passed on things only a longtime employee could know so well.
I found my copy on Ebay after I bought a reworked 1867/1867 Navy pistol. Then came across a couple of .22 Target pistols with Pope and Hubalek barrels, so wanted it for that info. I was pleasantly surprised at how much wonderful history was also found in it.

Vall