Help identifying rolling block

[Mhill0084]

I have a friend that has a rolling block and we are trying to find some information on the rifle. It was a mantle piece at his grandfathers house and has been in his safe since he passed. Also along the topside I found Remingtons ilion NY USA
Pat may 3d nov 15th 1864
April 17 186_. Don't know the last number. Also found the numbers 43769 on the lower tang. Any help is much appreciated.

[wlw-19958]

Hi There,

You have what appears to be a Remington rolling block
carbine with a type 2 action (meaning it has stepped
sides and the bar type extractor and firing pin retaining
screw in breach). The carbine model is fairly rare (less
than 10% of the rolling block production were carbines).

Have you determined the caliber? It will help in possibly
identifying the Country that ordered it.

The numbers on the upper and lower sides of the tang are
not serial numbers in the conventional sense. Rolling blocks
were built in lots and the lot size was somewhat dependent
on the contract and the number of rifles ordered at the time.
Upper and lower tang numbers were used to keep mated parts
together during the finishing process.

Good Luck!
-Blue Chips-
Webb

[Mhill0084]

I have not determine caliber yet. That is my next endeavor. Would figuring out the caliber change the value of the rifle?

[stanforth]

You ask about value. A rifle of a known calibre would always be more valuable than an unknown one.

[Mhill0084]

Can I get a ballpark value? The owner is thinking about selling it.

[marlinman93]

There are some rifle calibers I prefer not to own, or mess with. But that doesn't make them worth more or less; it simply makes them not my choice.
When it comes to some rifles the caliber can make a difference in values. I think an old Rolling Block in .45-70 is worth more than one in .50-70, but that's due to more people wanting the .45-70. But in the case of your gun I'm not sure it was available in .45-70 at that era? Likely it's a .50-70, but you'd need to do a chamber cast to confirm what it is. Hopefully the seller will let you, since he doesn't seem to know what it is either?

[freebird]

there's very litle chance for it to be a 45-70, although it would most certainly help with the price (as 45-70 is ubiquitous and easy/cheap to relad)

even 50-70 is not current in carbines. 50-45 is more likely, or one of the european calibers (.43 Egyptian, .43 Spanish), or in early carbine .52 Spencer.
A few measures (bore, chamber, rim diameter); i, the absence of a chamber cast, could give an idea.
so would a view of the chamber and the open breech block (the tang marking you describe seems to indicate an early fabrication)