1894 SXS Questions

[wannagohunting]

I just acquired 2 Rem 1894 SXS"s both on smaller frames for ga.
One is an A grade with ejectors 16ga made in 1902 , Damascus barrels . On the bottom of the dolls head there is only one v channel.

Two is a B grade with ejectors 12ga also made in 1902, Damascus barrels and also has one v channel on the bottom of the dolls head and has a capped pistol grip.

There is nothing in the Semmer book about frame sizes.
Is the one v channel the way to identify frame size?
I was told the capped pistol grip was special order only. True?

Are the B grades pretty rare?
Thank you,
Dale

[dieNusse1]

It's my understanding that the single V grove indicates the smaller frame while the double grove was used on the standard frame size. This is also true of the Model 1900.

Although differing frame sizes were mentioned for earlier models, I too could not find any reference for differing frame sizes for Models 1894 & 1900 in Semmers book. He did state that the B grade was somewhat rare in that people who could afford an engraved gun would more than likely select a higher grade.

Without seeing the gun, it would be difficult to determine whether or not the capped grip was special order from the factory. Indeed, it may not be possible at all. I'll let those with more experience answer that question.

[wannagohunting]

So I see I accidentally posted this in the handgun forum. Can someone move it to the shotgun forum or will I need to repost it.
Thank you,
Dale

[dieNusse1]

To followup the grip cap question - Remington stamped the stocks' S/N under the trigger guard tang. Is there a factory S/N stamped in that location?

[wannagohunting]

I haven't taken the trigger guard off but have no reason to believe it is aftermarket.


Thank you.

[wannagohunting]

So if it appears to be a factory grip cap was that a special order only option?

[dieNusse1]

A photo on page 136 of Semmers book shows a B stock with no grip cap. It is possible that your stock was a special order or came off a higher grade gun. A check of the S/N and grade stamped on the stock should indicate whether or not the stock is original to the gun.

[Researcher]

The choice of "half or Full pistol grip" was a standard catalog offering from 1899 onwards. Here are the B quality pages from the first 1902 Remington Arms Co. Catalogue --

1902 Catalogue B-, BE-Grade.jpeg (424.02 KiB) Viewed 7349 times

1902 Catalogue B.O.-, B.E.O.-Grade.jpeg (423.56 KiB) Viewed 7349 times

The 1902 Remington Arms Co. Catalogues were the first to picture all the various grades of the Remington Hammerless Double. From 1894 to 1899 they only pictured the A.- and A.E.-grades and just listed the other grades. The 1901 Remington Arms Co. Catalogues also pictured the K.- and K.E.D.-Grades.
No Remington Arms Co. Catalogue dated 1900 has come to light. I did see, a number of years ago, an 1899 with an insert for the K.- and K.E.D.-Grades on ebay, but I didn't win the auction. The 1902 Catalogues mention the option of straight grips for the D and E quality guns, and pictures a straight grip C quality gun on the Pigeon Gun page. Finally beginning with the 1908 Remington Arms Co. Catalogue they added the word straight to the C quality grip choices, and actually picture B quality and A quality Ordnance Steel barrel guns with straight grips but don't mention a straight grip option in the texts?!? A bit of disconnect between the folks in the office and those on the factory floor!!

[dieNusse1]

Thanks for the information. I still haven't been able to determine the difference between between a half or full pistol grip as offered in the catalog. Does one of these offerings include a grip cap? It doesn't appear that the drawings demonstrate this feature.

[wannagohunting]

Well by gosh there is no serial number on the wood under the trigger guard. What does that mean?

[Researcher]

The difference between a half-pistol and full-pistol grip on a Remington Hammerless Double is essentially the presence of a grip cap.

125000 09.jpg (273.52 KiB) Viewed 7335 times

P132280 08 16-ga DEO-Grade stock left 8x10.jpg (58 KiB) Viewed 7335 times

Though sometimes it looks like a grip cap put on a half-pistol grip.

107252 05.jpg (443.55 KiB) Viewed 7335 times

[dieNusse1]

Well that answers that question. Thanks!

Since there's no S/N it seems we now have a new question.

[Canvasback]

Interesting thread, seeing as I have two 1894 BE's in 12 gauge. One is from 1897 and the other from 1907. Both have the half grip.

Did not know about the connection between the V grooves and frame size. My 1897 gun has the double grooves. My 1907 gun is at the smiths right now so I can't check it. It's being re-stocked as the original stock was a mess. I'm slightly upgrading the stock, seeing as I'm going to the expense, rather than an exact, grade accurate replacement. It's going to be a mix of C and D grade wood, chequering and drop points.

Wannagohunting, what are the specs on your gun? I'd like to compare with mine and if LOP and barrel length are similar, would be interesting to see the weight difference between the smaller and larger frame size guns.

My 1897 gun has 30" Damascus barrels and an LOP of 14". It weighs 7 pounds 9 oz. The barrels on their own are 3 pounds 12 oz and have a minimum barrel wall thickness of .045 and a bore of .731. So the rest of the gun (stock, action and forend) weighs 3 pounds 13 oz.

[Researcher]

My two 16-gauge guns are both ejector guns, on the late style action, both with 28-inch barrels, both weigh within a fraction of an ounce of seven pounds. The DEO-grade has the two groves style ejector guide --

P132280 15.JPG (515.68 KiB) Viewed 7231 times

and the KE-grade has the single V-groove.

Q380786 01 KE-Grade 16-Gauge.JPG (571.7 KiB) Viewed 7231 times

[Canvasback]

Reasearcher, interesting that the two are so similar in weight. Makes one wonder what the point of the different sized receivers may have been.