Remington Model 14 has a little "play" .
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wiktor
Remington Model 14 has a little "play" .
Hi All, I was looking at another model 14 today and it had a very little up and down "play" between the receiver halves, rocks on the takedown screw. Again very little and both serial numbers match. Gun OK and any solutions?
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Rickster
Re: Remington Model 14 has a little "play" .
Looseness in the two halves can easily be tightened up by careful peening in the right places. But if it is loose there, then there is probably wear in the action as well, and that is a much harder problem to fix. Try dry firing it. If the trigger is very mushy, and you want it for a shooter, think twice. A mushy trigger usually means that the locking surfaces are worn. It doesn't take much. There are 6 locking surfaces. A few thousands wear on each and the tolerance stacks up to 10 or 20 thousands. This allows the bolt to drop a little at the front. As it does, the tail piece that the trigger works against tips up, teeter totter like, creating play in the trigger. Any looseness in the two halves compounds the problem. Almost all these old 14s have some trigger play. I had one that was so bad that it wouldn't fire, exempt sometimes after a delay. Completely unsafe. There is a fix, but it is not easy. The best way to judge the 14s is by the trigger. Oh, and look down the bore of course.
Re: Remington Model 14 has a little "play" .
Wik!
Before beating on machined areas (peening) and possibly doing serious damage, might I "suggest" you try a replacement take down screw. New replacements from Wisner's are an absolute match, it could be your old one has a bit of wear on it. I guess the good news would be that a far more common problem is too tight of fit caused by dings to the channels or even a bit of warpage to the trigger guard.
I will add that any trigger problem can be cured by taking it down, cleaning the parts, and if necessary replacing the spring. Sometimes the older guns accumulate dried oil and gunk in the cavity for the "trigger spring rod". The "rod" ends up in the grooves of the cross bolt safety which is another area that can be gunky. In some cases it is so bad that the safety needs to be driven out with a brass punch. If you have not had the pleasure of doing this, it is a must to attempt for novice M14 owners but be prepared to crawl around the floor looking for the "trigger spring cap". If you know what you are doing, the job takes about 10 minutes.
Before beating on machined areas (peening) and possibly doing serious damage, might I "suggest" you try a replacement take down screw. New replacements from Wisner's are an absolute match, it could be your old one has a bit of wear on it. I guess the good news would be that a far more common problem is too tight of fit caused by dings to the channels or even a bit of warpage to the trigger guard.
I will add that any trigger problem can be cured by taking it down, cleaning the parts, and if necessary replacing the spring. Sometimes the older guns accumulate dried oil and gunk in the cavity for the "trigger spring rod". The "rod" ends up in the grooves of the cross bolt safety which is another area that can be gunky. In some cases it is so bad that the safety needs to be driven out with a brass punch. If you have not had the pleasure of doing this, it is a must to attempt for novice M14 owners but be prepared to crawl around the floor looking for the "trigger spring cap". If you know what you are doing, the job takes about 10 minutes.
Jim Peterson
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Rickster
Re: Remington Model 14 has a little "play" .
Just to clarify my earlier comments, not to pick a fight.
Its my opinion that the slots at the back were designed to maintain alignment of the two receiver halves and to bear loads created during firing and carrying. The takedown pin (screw) is small in relation to recoil forces, and was not designed to be load bearing. It is only designed to keep the two halves fully engaged in their slots. I certainly agree that beating on machined surfaces is not a good idea. But the slots at the back loosen over time due to self peening as the rifle is fired and carried. It is not a sin to peen them back into shape. And to be clear, only a very light peening is required.
I certainly agree that grime in the trigger area is a common problem that can normally be fixed by cleaning and/or parts swapping. But the wear problem I was referring to is more serious because it also results in increased headspace and reduced locking lug engagement. So, to provide a little more clarity, here is how I check for internal wear of the locking surfaces. With the rifle unloaded, cocked and safety off, hold the rifle horizontally and upside down (at shoulder height with muzzle pointing left). Again, the rifle must be unloaded and cocked with the safety off. Hold the left end by the barrel, leaving the slide free to move. Now, while looking into the ejection port, pull the trigger back and forth only far enough to take up any slack, not far enough to release the sear. The breech block (aka, bolt), visible through the ejection port, will move slightly up and down. The amount that it moves is the sum of the factory tolerance plus the wear on the locking surfaces. I cant give you a number for how much is too much, but movement in a like new 141 will be barely perceptible. Movement in an old used 14 will be obvious.
Its my opinion that the slots at the back were designed to maintain alignment of the two receiver halves and to bear loads created during firing and carrying. The takedown pin (screw) is small in relation to recoil forces, and was not designed to be load bearing. It is only designed to keep the two halves fully engaged in their slots. I certainly agree that beating on machined surfaces is not a good idea. But the slots at the back loosen over time due to self peening as the rifle is fired and carried. It is not a sin to peen them back into shape. And to be clear, only a very light peening is required.
I certainly agree that grime in the trigger area is a common problem that can normally be fixed by cleaning and/or parts swapping. But the wear problem I was referring to is more serious because it also results in increased headspace and reduced locking lug engagement. So, to provide a little more clarity, here is how I check for internal wear of the locking surfaces. With the rifle unloaded, cocked and safety off, hold the rifle horizontally and upside down (at shoulder height with muzzle pointing left). Again, the rifle must be unloaded and cocked with the safety off. Hold the left end by the barrel, leaving the slide free to move. Now, while looking into the ejection port, pull the trigger back and forth only far enough to take up any slack, not far enough to release the sear. The breech block (aka, bolt), visible through the ejection port, will move slightly up and down. The amount that it moves is the sum of the factory tolerance plus the wear on the locking surfaces. I cant give you a number for how much is too much, but movement in a like new 141 will be barely perceptible. Movement in an old used 14 will be obvious.
Re: Remington Model 14 has a little "play" .
Wik!
Another thought is the trigger bushings come in a variety of inside diameters (and outside diameters). You may have one of the earlier ones that was a little more open, coupled with a bit of wear on the take down screw you can get a bit of play. I have never seen one so sloppy that you could not compensate by "really" tightening down on the take down screw.
Another thought is the trigger bushings come in a variety of inside diameters (and outside diameters). You may have one of the earlier ones that was a little more open, coupled with a bit of wear on the take down screw you can get a bit of play. I have never seen one so sloppy that you could not compensate by "really" tightening down on the take down screw.
Jim Peterson
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wiktor
Re: Remington Model 14 has a little "play" .
Thanks for the reply's Guys! The rifle looks like it was carried alot but not shot much. Trigger pull is actually very good and much better than most of the 14's I have or have had. Just the little bit of rock between the receiver halves. I'll try a new screw but I figured it must also have a little play between the bearing surfaces (maybe from being carried alot??)to have a little play? Thanks Guy's!!