RB questions

[grizzone47]

Had been shooting reproduction Sharps, Rolling Blocks and HighWalls when I saw this rifle at a Cabelas store about ten years ago. Looks like an original to me wearing new wood, at least the stock has a small white plastic insert for sling hardware to attach. Stock had 15.3 inch length of pull which I've cut down to 14 inches. Somebody big once owned this gun. Forearm had a solid hunk of lead poured in to look like a pewter tip, but was broken loose. I made and attached an ebony schnable. The 1.3 inch wide receiver, trigger guard and hammer all still show light color case hardening. Same serial number on barrel , receiver and trigger guard. Steel cresent buttstock has no number. The 28.5 Octagon barrel tapers from 1.110 to 1.010 at the muzzle, marked 45-70 and 12347. Bore is excellent. Globe sight looks old to me with fine lettering 'U.S. PAT NO. 1,901.339.' Buckhorn sight is modern manufacture. I replaced a junk spaggetti tang sight for a Lee Shaver economy Soule. I shoot black powder loads and use the Dave Crossno .22 barrel insert. Both shoot great.
I could not make out the store's price tag, sloppy writting, though I thought it read $1395 and figured I might just be taking the rifle home with me. Asked the salesman about it and he said it was part of a big estate sale they had purchased and 'it is what it is' as he put it. When asked to confirm the price he said $395. Holding my composer I asked if that was the best he could do. He said $375 was his best price. I hoped he did not see my fingers tremble as I wrote the check.
My question is what model, (#1 sporter?) and approx year of manufacture and am I going to hell for talking him down an extra $20

Roy

[vulture]

That is a very fine looking rifle. I own several RB's in their original military configuration and love shooting them, but I've wished I could afford to have one of them redone in 45-70 and then I would restock it with a Hawken rifle style stock with barrel wedges to attach the front wood and the butt stock having a cheak piece much like yours with a buttplate like yours. I would mount a ramrod rib under the octagon barrel in front of the front wood with ramrod thimbles, then install a nice hickory ramrod. It would look some what like the "Gemmer Sharps" that was built by Shilo some years ago. In the meantime I'll just keep shooting them the way they are, they are great rifles. Stew.

[rudybolla]

Yes, you are going to Hell for getting the guy to take $20 off. The only way you can be absolved of this sin is to immediately send the rifle to me to be exorcised of its demons! Great catch, incidentally.

[Dick Hosmer]

Nice-looking rifle. I could be VERY wrong, but I'm not sure it is original, though you still "stole" it.

When Cabelas started their antique business, they had NO idea what the prices were, and some bargains were definitely had. Somehow, they became aware of this and the cure (seemingly still in place today) was to overprice everything. I have only visited one store in person (Reno NV) and was NOT pleased, and will not return. I realize that this is subjective as staff will vary from location to location, of course.

It seems that they are just a "big box" store, hiring minimum-wage staff, with little to no gun savvy, and run by MBAs. None of the "warmth" or near-instant "at home feeling" of the old corner gun-shop. When defects (some glaring) were pointed out on various high-priced "collector" Springfields, the answer was pretty much "so what - the price is the price - get out the way so the next guy in line can see it."

[jon_norstog]

The sights are worth what you paid for the whole rifle.

jn

[Don Kenna]

I believe the only thing original is the action, which looks like a standard #1 sporter. It could, I suppose, be a reconfigured early #1 military done by someone who really knew what they were about--sculpting the trigger guard, making the receiver rebate, faceting the receiver ring, etc. But I don't think so. Later military actions--and that means the majority of them--used the rotary extractor. I believe all sporter actions--or at least all that I've seen in person and in pictures--used the earlier type sliding extractor, which is what your rifle has. The action had been refinished. The case colors are still pretty vivid, which probably gives that away. What's for sure is that Remington never case hardened the hammers and breech blocks, but blued these parts (or in a very few cases plated them). All the other parts are newly made.

"When was the action made?" I'd guess somewhere between 1873, when Remington started making significant numbers of true #1 sporting actions, and 1888, when they largely stopped making that model.

Having said all that, yours is a very handsome rifle. And it looks like something a custom gunsmith of the 1870s would have made up, right down to that "murderous" crescent buttplate. The latter look great, but can be pretty brutal to shoot for more than a couple of shots at a time. (I'd immediately put on a slip-on recoil pad when I shot it.)

Don

[Floop]

Here is my #1 Sporter made in ~1877. It does have the sliding extractor. The tangs on the breech block and hammer look quite a bit different. The top of the receiver has distinct flats. The action thickness, when measured with a micrometer, falls in between a military #1 and a #1-1/2 Sporter. The picture does not show it, but the full octagon barrel would be 28" and tapered from 1-1/8" at the receiver down to 1" across the flats at the muzzle.




It looks to me like the action is perhaps a reworked military action with an aftermarket, non-tapered barrel. Still a great bargain even so, considering that the sights are worth what you paid for the whole gun.

[Yellowhouse]

I think reworked. If the lower tang is the same length as the upper then it is very likely a military.