Model 14 - Dissassembly

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nambujim
Posts: 529
Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2006 3:16 pm
Location: Charlotte, NC

Re: Model 14 - Dissassembly

Post by nambujim »

I have both an early one and the later smooth one listed on Gunbroker.
The early ones were used on rifles under "about" 20,000 and the smooth ones until about 123,000. Forgot what I'm asking but the older one is about $56 and the smooth one about $75 plus $8 postage in a small priority box, otherwise the post office will find a way of crushing them.

This is the most broken part on the rifle, the flange is very delicate, and they are sold AS-IS because unless you know what you are doing during the installation you can either bend the cover or break the flange. Mine are solid.

Jim Peterson
Charlotte, NC
Jim Peterson
lesb
Posts: 9
Joined: Mon Nov 27, 2017 8:01 am
Location: West Virginia

Re: Model 14 - Dissassembly

Post by lesb »

Well, I have a 141, but have found this information exchange on the 14 and 14 1/2 to be very interesting!! Thanks to all who posted here. I especially liked the diagram...
Best Regards, Les

NRA Benefactor Member
Jim585
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Joined: Sat Jul 21, 2018 6:04 pm

Re: Model 14 - Dissassembly

Post by Jim585 »

I am looking for contact info for NambuJim, as I would like to send him my 141 for repair.
Thank you, Jim585
nambujim
Posts: 529
Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2006 3:16 pm
Location: Charlotte, NC

Re: Model 14 - Dissassembly

Post by nambujim »

Jim!

I send you my email address!

What is the serial of your rifle, what seems to be the problem, and what caliber is it?

Jim Peterson
Charlotte, NC
Jim Peterson
jimbocious
Posts: 6
Joined: Tue Nov 20, 2018 8:03 am

Re: Model 14 1/2 jammed open

Post by jimbocious »

Hi, I bought a 14-1/2 in 38-40 but the slide is stuck in the open position so I can't disassemble. Any tips? Thanks.
nambujim
Posts: 529
Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2006 3:16 pm
Location: Charlotte, NC

Re: Model 14 - Dissassembly

Post by nambujim »

Try removing the stock, remove the butt plate, and then with a very long screwdriver stick it down the hole in the buttstock until you make contact
with the stock bolt...............remove the stock bolt and then pull the stock away from the lower receiver. That might free it up, if so you need to remove some wood from inside the stock. If not it will at least give you full access to the bolt.

I have a feeling the bolt and the entire area inside are full of gunk, hope you didn't buy it with it already stuck.

Jim Peterson
Charlotte, NC
Jim Peterson
jimbocious
Posts: 6
Joined: Tue Nov 20, 2018 8:03 am

Re: Model 14 - Dissassembly

Post by jimbocious »

Thanks NambuJim.... I have removed the stock and the fore-end for access but it's stuck tight. The gun is pretty clean and unfortunately it was me who f-ed it up because I forgot the slide should be forward before separating the 2 halves and I kind of forced it into being jammed when the slide was back in the open position and I tried to disassemble from that position....D'Oh! Super dumb as this gun completed my collection of all 6 Model 14 calibers so I really should have known better (or at least re-watched the Youtube videos as a refresher!). fwiw, the trigger won't move, the safety won't engage/disengage from its current position, and I have not been able to get any parts to move or reset by pushing or pulling them. Any other thoughts?? Thanks a ton!
nambujim
Posts: 529
Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2006 3:16 pm
Location: Charlotte, NC

Re: Model 14 - Dissassembly

Post by nambujim »

Well, you and others might not like it but without having it on my bench I can't say for certain. When all else fails you can place a brass or nylon block against the back of the bolt and try to drive it forward with a good size hammer OR pack it up the way it is and send it to me.......I do have some replacement bolts and countless trigger assemblies.

Best of luck!

Jim
Jim Peterson
jimbocious
Posts: 6
Joined: Tue Nov 20, 2018 8:03 am

Re: Model 14 - Dissassembly

Post by jimbocious »

Thanks NambuJim -- I managed to push the bolt assembly back to the front (closed) position and disassemble for cleaning etc. The problem appears to be that the front magazine guide and/or magazine tube was bent or misaligned and made it stick in the open position.

BUT, in working on cleaning the breechblock of this early production 38-40 (serial number 35,###), it appears to be a slightly different design compared to my later 44-40 (serial number 87,###) in that that the firing pin extension (the flat hook-like protrusion from the rear of the breechblock) is missing, BUT further, that the the firing pin catch (part #31) is also not only not there, but there is no hole in the receiver for the firing pin catch pin and no indent for the firing pin catch spring --- in other words, you couldn't install one if you had one.....

Is this a known earlier design or am I imagining things?
nambujim
Posts: 529
Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2006 3:16 pm
Location: Charlotte, NC

Re: Model 14 - Dissassembly

Post by nambujim »

Yes, it is of a different design!

Your 35,000 range rifle does NOT have the hook/lever safety, they came into play around 60,000 although I have seen them on guns with extremely low serials, they didn't manufacture by serial number.

Virtually every part of the Model 14/14-1/2 was changed during the manufacturing process, many parts changed several times, and the bolt was changed at "least" five times as were parts inside the bolt. It is a real crapshoot to find the right part for any "one" gun. Each rifle was parts specific.

An example of this is that I have consecutive serial .30 caliber rifles in the 65,000 range and there are thirteen differences in the parts used, that is thirteen that I've found. Another example is if I get a rifle in that needs a cartridge stop I will dump all my stops out on the bench (maybe 50), half of them won't even fit in the slot in the frame. The changes were endless and too numerous to count.

Good luck!

Jim
Jim Peterson
jimbocious
Posts: 6
Joined: Tue Nov 20, 2018 8:03 am

Re: Model 14 - Dissassembly

Post by jimbocious »

Thanks, good to know I wasn't going crazy. Now, to see if it fires will be the next step.... It goes "click" and cycles when I pull the trigger but now need some ammo.

On that note, most of what is available is very low fps "Cowboy" loads -- any issues or advice on 38-40 ammo?

Jim
nambujim
Posts: 529
Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2006 3:16 pm
Location: Charlotte, NC

Re: Model 14 - Dissassembly

Post by nambujim »

No real advice but factory stuff is bloody expensive but should feed nicely in your rifle, these rifles are very fussy about the ammo and OACL is critical. If you are just a hair too long you will get feed problems and jams.

Jim2
Jim Peterson
jimbocious
Posts: 6
Joined: Tue Nov 20, 2018 8:03 am

Re: Model 14 - Dissassembly

Post by jimbocious »

Cool, thanks for all our help and advice Jim....great to know the true source of deep knowledge on Model 14s! If you are ever up in Northern VA for gun shows please post so we might meet up.....

Jim
JRLesan
Posts: 4
Joined: Tue Nov 27, 2018 7:25 am

Re: Model 14 - Dissassembly

Post by JRLesan »

My model 14 carbine's takedown screw comes completely out of the plain bushing. I suspect, from reading takedown instructions, that there was at one time a 'stay' either on the bushing or td screw to prevent the screw from falling out. Can someone verify and possibly describe the 'stay'? Thanks...
nambujim
Posts: 529
Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2006 3:16 pm
Location: Charlotte, NC

Re: Model 14 - Dissassembly

Post by nambujim »

I would say offhand that about 40% of the takedown screws have either lost the retaining insert or it has become so worn it won't hold the screw in place. I would NOT worry about it, it actually makes the rifle easier to work on when you take it down for cleaning.

The part is actually a tiny little wedge about 3/16" long and a 1/16" wide AND they are an absolute bitch to try and re-install. My solution if a customer really-really wants to have the retainer in place is to install another one taken from a parts gun .............so much easier, it does have to be removed with the screw being retained....duh!

Again, I would not worry about it and to add to that argument I have some like new rifles that have the retainer in place but the screw simply falls out.

Interesting note is the bushing size for the 141 is slightly larger than those of the Model 14 so they are NOT readily interchangable.

Jim Peterson
Charlotte, NC
Jim Peterson
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