Free Floating Barrels

[342caribou]

I've been shooting high power rifles for 20+ years and it's always been my understanding that rifles with free floating barrels were the "most accurate"; a floating barrel does does not have the additional vibrations from contact with the stock hence it can shoot smaller groups.

My guess is that the Remington engineers know this better than anyone but the Model 700s (mine is a 700 BDL Stainless Steel) do not have floating barrels. They have a bump on the front of the stock that the barrel rests on.

I think the rifles from the custom shop have floating barrels but not the less expensive Model 700s.

Anybody know the rationale for not floating the barrels. Also, does it make sense to gring down the bump on my stock so the barrell floats. Would that be a way to squeeze out another 1/4 moa of accuracy?

Thanks

[Rem725]

In earlier times when all stocks were wood, freefloating was done to keep the warping wood from bearing on the barrel with changes in temp and humidity.
The average production rifle was not intended to be a "benchrest" rifle so they added the point contact to keep the wood lined up with the metal for appearance sake.

In reality a freefloated barrel usually shoots best. But a properly located vibration dampening bump can sometimes improve a freefloater. We used to move a contact shim up and down the barrel channel with standard weight barrels. Compare that with the stock screws on 40x rifles, and todays "tuners" screwed onto the muzzle.

[Dave]

Long ago I purchased a used Rem. 700 varminter in 22-250. The guy I bought it from sold it to me at a VERY low price because he said it couldn't shoot a group smaller than 3"s at 50 yards. At the price I got it for I figured I could replace the barrel and still have a 700 with very little money in it. When I got it home I figured maybe the bore was just fouled. I scrubbed and scrubbed until I got a clean rag. Then I went to the range and fired it for groups. He was right. It didn't shoot very well. At the time I was young and inexperienced with 700s. But I noticed the bit of stock the barrel was resting on. I did know that free floating barrels were suppose to have better accuracy. I even thought at the time that the stock must have gotten wet or something and the wood had swelled. So, not knowing that the hump was supposed to be there, I proceeded to file it off. I then brought it back to the range and proceeded to shoot a group of ten rounds at 100 yards that you could cover with a dime. That rifle is now the most accurate rifle I have (I have over 50 rifles). If the shooter is able, that gun will shoot 1/2 MOA all day long. So my advice to you is, if your 700 shoots below a MOA then leave it alone. If you can't get 1 MOA out of it then remove the hump and try it again. I'm VERY VERY glad I did it.

HTH
Dave

[342caribou]

My 700 is a 300 Winchester and I shoot Federal premium 180 grain nosler partitions. Its groups between 1 1/2 to 2 inches at 100 yards.

I always assumed that the rifle shot better than my 50 year old eyes could focus on the target. However, last month's American Hunter did an evaluation of the Model700 XCR and they published groups between 1 1/2 and 2 1/2 inches with Remington dactory ammo.

I was suprised at their results...could it be that for a "standard" factory Model 700 with factory ammo 100 yeard groups of around 2 inches are the norm?

[Dave]

IF you’re lucky you can get 2" groups with the new Remingtons. All 3 of my 700s(22-250,7mm mag and 6mm Rem) are the older rounded checkering ones from the 60's. They all shoot below 1 min. of angle if the shooter does his part. But the new ones just don't do that. I'm sure the crappie triggers today have something to do with that. But I have a friend and fellow high power shooter that always wanted a 700 varmiter and finally scraped up the coin to buy one 2 or 3 years ago. We tried 4 or 5 kinds of factory ammo and countless different hand loads and couldn't get it to shoot less than 3 MOA with most of the loads doing worse. We swaged the barrel and surfice it to say the bore was far from ideal. He contacted Remington and they had him send it to them. They sent it back with no changes and told him the rifles accuracy was within acceptable tolerances. Long story short, he replaced the barrel with a Shillen (Sp?) and now it shoots below 1MOA. He could barely afford the gun and ended up paying $200 or more, that he couldn't afford, to make it shoot. His is not the only story like that that I know of personally. So, I guess what I'm saying is, if you want MOA accuracy don't expect it from the new Remingtons. Unless of course you order one from the custom shop. I hear that Remington picks through their barrels and sends the good ones to the custom shop and the rest go on the BDL's and ADL's.

[Rem725]

What you say about new production does not surprise me at all. They don't make them like they used to.

[HKcarbine]

I must have the 1 in a 100. My stock XR-100 .223REm will shoot 1/4 to1/2 groups at 100yds with reloads. nothing done to rifle except adjust the trigger. This is areally nice rifle!

[Dave]

The description on the Remington site about the XR-100 says:

"Thought a competition-grade target rifle was out of your reach? Think again. The Model XR-100 Rangemaster single shot target rifle, based on the legendary Remington XP-100™ pistol action, delivers match-grade accuracy at half the cost of a traditional custom target rifle."

This leads me to believe that this isn't your "normal every day" Remington. Also it doesn't look like eather of my 600s. Looks like a 700 action to me. It definitely has the 700 bolt.
I also wanted to say that my opinion on bad accuracy doesn't stop with Remingtons. Most of the other manufacturers aren't any better. If you want MOA accuracy you have to go to the very high end guns. In my experience rifles like Weatherby, Sako and some of the AR-15 clones have good or great barrels and they shoot as they should. Oh for the good olds days when you could buy a rifle off the shelf and expect at least reasonable accuracy. I get a kick out of a lot of the gun writers these days making excuses for the poor accuracy the new guns have by saying that it OK, it's still good enough for hunting. I guess they have to say something besides this gun doesn't shoot to good.

[gunnut69]

The rational behind the pressure point is the frequency control it produces. Barrels vibrate like tuning forks when they are fired. The pressure point raises the frequency and thus lowers the normal group size.. the real value of a free floating barrel is it's not being affected by the movement of the stock as it is affected by moisture. Also long stirngs of fire can cause the barrel to heat and if it's tapered and most sporters are the pressure will change on the pressure pad as the tube heats and grows. It the main reason many rifle tend to walk bullets as the barrel is fired and heated up. The old mauser M98s used a paralell sided barrel with steps so that as the tube heated and grew in length the pressure of the barrels contact with the stock would not change. Properly bedding rilfes with sporter to light weight barrels usually shoot their best with a bit of forearm pressure. If the bedding is poor as most are these days from the manufacturers the flaoted barrel tend to put less emphasis on action bedding and so shoot a bit better. In the old days many target rifles were free floated, not to help with their accuracy but to avoid the change in impact when tension fromt a tight sling was applied. Nobody uses a sling for shooting much any more so the reason is moot. I usually remove the pressure point in Remington rifles before checking the bedding and fixing it as needed. Then shoot to determine if the rifle is shooting as I wish for the job the rifle is to do.. If more accuracy is needed a temporary pressure point can be put in a the rifle retested. Usually you find that a bit of pressure makes them shoot a bit better. As to accuracy my last contact with a new Remington was a CDL 30-06 owned by a close friend. Last summer we shot it in with a new scope and the rifle was easily capable of less than 1 inch groups with factory ammo. Function was perfect.

[The Rifleman]

I wrote a long and drawn out note to a forum member about a Model 721 that my father bought new in 1955 along with a Weaver 4 x scope.

It was terrible, it wouldn't hit the target a day after you sighted it in.

He bought it at the PX while he was in the NAVY.

There was no sending back guns 50 years ago.

You learned to live with it.

One day my Uncles nephew from Connecticut came down to hunt deer and brought a man by the name of Richard E. Perkins with him.

He took a sheet of newspaper and showed him how to check the free float of the barrel and how to change the stock.

My dad glass bedded it and now it shoots 1 - 1/2 moa all day long.