Original 1863 Remington New Model Army ? info ?

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Laurent
Posts: 6
Joined: Sun Sep 02, 2018 7:25 am

Original 1863 Remington New Model Army ? info ?

Post by Laurent » Sun Sep 02, 2018 8:11 am

Hi,

I'm French, I just bought a Remington 1863 but I have difficulty to identify exactly this model.

Please, could you help me to know more about this one ?

We can read 3 different numbers :
50
953
078523

and "PATENTED MARCH 17 1863 E REMINGTON & SONS ILION NY NEW MODEL 44 CAL" only with 2 lines

I hope my pictures will be better than my poor english ...

Image
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Don't hesitate to ask me more details or pictures

Many thanks :wink:
Laurent

Patbar
Posts: 26
Joined: Mon Dec 26, 2016 4:14 am

Re: Original 1863 Remington New Model Army ? info ?

Post by Patbar » Mon Sep 03, 2018 1:23 am

Laurent, I'm afraid that your gun is a fake. The markings on the barrel are not the right ones which should read on 3 lines and in smaller letters :
PATENTED SEPT. 14,1858
E.REMINGTON & SONS, ILION, NEW YORK, U.S.A.
NEW MODEL

Beside that, the serial numbers are not stamped at the right places.

http://www.remingtonsociety.org/forums/ ... ew&id=4123
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billt
Posts: 182
Joined: Tue Apr 22, 2003 6:42 pm

Re: Original 1863 Remington New Model Army ? info ?

Post by billt » Mon Sep 03, 2018 8:18 am

I am not sure I would call your revolver a fake. It is not an original Remington built in the 1860’s during the American Civil War. It seems to be a replica probably manufactured in the mid to late 1900’s for Black Powder Shooters who did not want to spend high dollars to shoot an original antique. Replicas are still made today by Pietta and Uberti.

Bill

Laurent
Posts: 6
Joined: Sun Sep 02, 2018 7:25 am

Re: Original 1863 Remington New Model Army ? info ?

Post by Laurent » Mon Sep 03, 2018 2:02 pm

Damned :cry:

Many thanks Bill for your quick reply even if it's not what I expected

I have already some modern replicas from pietta at least this one is old and looks like authentical :roll:

I will be more attentive for my next transaction

Thanks again, and I hope to be back there soon

Laurent

Patbar
Posts: 26
Joined: Mon Dec 26, 2016 4:14 am

Re: Original 1863 Remington New Model Army ? info ?

Post by Patbar » Tue Sep 04, 2018 1:11 am

billt wrote:
Mon Sep 03, 2018 8:18 am
I am not sure I would call your revolver a fake. It is not an original Remington built in the 1860’s during the American Civil War. It seems to be a replica probably manufactured in the mid to late 1900’s for Black Powder Shooters who did not want to spend high dollars to shoot an original antique. Replicas are still made today by Pietta and Uberti.

Bill
I wrote that Laurent's revolver was a fake simply because the title of his thread was "Original 1863 Remington New Model Army". But of course, I have a good knowledge or modern blackpowder replicas which started being produced in 1959.

And it's a fake also because the Italian proofmarks, the warning "black powder only" and other markings have apparently been erased to make believe it was an original.

Laurent
Posts: 6
Joined: Sun Sep 02, 2018 7:25 am

Re: Original 1863 Remington New Model Army ? info ?

Post by Laurent » Wed Sep 05, 2018 5:19 am

Hi Patbar,

Many thanks for your replies

For you, no doubt ? it's an italian replica ?

I can't find any information about other NMA with same marking nor original nor replica :?

Thanks again for your knowledge and help :wink:

Patbar
Posts: 26
Joined: Mon Dec 26, 2016 4:14 am

Re: Original 1863 Remington New Model Army ? info ?

Post by Patbar » Thu Sep 06, 2018 1:17 am

The Remington New Model Army replicas have been produced mainly in Italy, and few of them in Spain. So, no doubt for me, your gun is one of these replicas that someone who had never seen an original tried to make it look like one.

Laurent
Posts: 6
Joined: Sun Sep 02, 2018 7:25 am

Re: Original 1863 Remington New Model Army ? info ?

Post by Laurent » Thu Sep 06, 2018 11:31 am

many thanks for all these information Patbar :wink:

Laurent
Posts: 6
Joined: Sun Sep 02, 2018 7:25 am

Re: Original 1863 Remington New Model Army ? info ?

Post by Laurent » Thu Sep 06, 2018 1:33 pm

I talked with the person who sold me this revolver.

He has confirmed me that he bought it on 1970 to another people who had indicated him it was previously the property of his grandfather.

French army bought 20000 NMA arround 1870, it seems all these revolver have been polished by french army.

What I don't understand it's why there is 2 different serial numbers !
If it's a replica, absolutely no reason from my point of view.

Is it possible French Army erased original serial number to wrotte a own serial number, but not on all parts ? Do you think is possible ?

Do you have some information about this contract with French Army ?

Many thanks and kind regards

Patbar
Posts: 26
Joined: Mon Dec 26, 2016 4:14 am

Re: Original 1863 Remington New Model Army ? info ?

Post by Patbar » Fri Sep 07, 2018 1:20 am

Yes Laurent, the French "Defense Nationale" bought Remington revolvers during the war of 1870 against Prussia, and I have one of these in my collection. They were "put in the white" (all the blue removed) but the original markings and serial numbers were respected.

But your gun is definitely not one of these because as I wrote before, the markings on the barrel are totally fanciful (look again at the photo in my previous post to see what the real markings were), and the "serial numbers" (there should only be one) are totally misplaced.

So, I insist on saying that it is a modern replica made post 1960 and sorry to say, but for my part, the guy who sold you the gun didn't tell the truth about his grandfather having this revolver.

Laurent
Posts: 6
Joined: Sun Sep 02, 2018 7:25 am

Re: Original 1863 Remington New Model Army ? info ?

Post by Laurent » Sun Sep 09, 2018 1:33 am

Thanks again Patbar

Normally, i will see 2 supposed originals next week, i will go back there if you are ok to help me with your knowledge and advice :roll:

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