RESEARCH PROJECT: BELT/RYDER REVOLVERS

Topics related to Pre - 1898 Remington Pistols
CALIBRE44
Posts: 136
Joined: Fri Jan 22, 2010 6:31 pm
Location: Florida

RESEARCH PROJECT: BELT/RYDER REVOLVERS

Post by CALIBRE44 »

I am doing a personal research project on Remington Belt SA and Ryder DA Revolvers. If you have one or more and wish to contribute some information, contact me through a Private Message. No other member will see this info.

I would need the following information;
Model Belt or Ryder.
Serial number under side of barrel and under grips.
Calibre .36 or converted to .38, (cf or rf)
If converted,numbers on cylinder.
Cylinder Fluted or Round.
Barrel 6 1/2" or cut to ?.
Front sight ,Cone or Blade.
Nickel, Blue and/or engraved.
Grips wood or ?.
Any other numbers or letters stamped on the revolver.
Barrel address on Ryder, two lines or three lines.
Thank you in advance...............................Jim
Last edited by CALIBRE44 on Thu Jan 26, 2017 1:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
billt
Posts: 234
Joined: Tue Apr 22, 2003 6:42 pm

Re: RESEARCH PROJECT: BELT/RYDER REVOLVERS

Post by billt »

Jim,
You might want to add the barrel address. The DA early ones had a two line address and the later ones a three line address.

Bill
Henry II
Posts: 11
Joined: Fri Aug 18, 2017 2:24 pm

Re: RESEARCH PROJECT: BELT/RYDER REVOLVERS

Post by Henry II »

Hello CALIBRE44
If you're still into that research
I just got hold of a Riders .36 DA S/N 17XX in nearly excellent condition.
I'm new to this forum and haven't found my way around yet.
Tell me how to PM you

Henry II
CALIBRE44
Posts: 136
Joined: Fri Jan 22, 2010 6:31 pm
Location: Florida

Re: RESEARCH PROJECT: BELT/RYDER REVOLVERS

Post by CALIBRE44 »

HenryII: Thank you for agreeing to my research.
However, "Len" we spoke on the other Remington forum (Calibre32). I will now add your fine Rider to the Survey. The survival rate appears to be very low. I can not add any additional info at this time. Awaiting other revolvers to add to the survey. Feel free to contact me at any time. Also have other Remington models. .......Jim
Henry II
Posts: 11
Joined: Fri Aug 18, 2017 2:24 pm

Re: RESEARCH PROJECT: BELT/RYDER REVOLVERS

Post by Henry II »

Hello CALIBRE,

there's a Riders for sale at this place:
http://www.mickessvartkrutsvapen.com/20 ... n-belt-da/
Price is about $4,700
DA mechanism defect
No serial number given
Has a three lines address
CALIBRE44
Posts: 136
Joined: Fri Jan 22, 2010 6:31 pm
Location: Florida

Re: RESEARCH PROJECT: BELT/RYDER REVOLVERS

Post by CALIBRE44 »

Hi Henry: No serial number listed, so I can't add it to the list.
Asking more that 2X value.
He does not know what he has, says SA, wrong, that is why it won't cock. DA only as you know...................Jim

Has Remington and Sons, could be an early one. Asked for serial #, but may not answer me...
admin
Site Admin
Posts: 660
Joined: Tue Dec 03, 2002 2:14 pm

Re: RESEARCH PROJECT: BELT/RYDER REVOLVERS

Post by admin »

I ofter send email to listers on gunbroker, gunsinternational, etc asking for the serial and actually I don't recall any not giving it or being a jerk about it.
If you want page on the current research let me know I could even write up a fill in auto mailer for you.
Eskilgh
Posts: 32
Joined: Fri Jan 25, 2013 3:01 pm
Location: Norway

Re: RESEARCH PROJECT: BELT/RYDER REVOLVERS

Post by Eskilgh »

Hi
Here are a few.

Rider
236
percussion
Fluted cyl
Barrel 6 1/2
Post front sight
No barrel address
Blued
Wood grips

Rider
4576
Percussion
Ord. cylinder
Barrel 6 1/2
Blade front sight
Two line barrel address
Blued
Wood grips

Belt
7851
Conversion
Barrel 6 1/2
Blade front sight
Three line address
Nickel
Wood grips

Hoping for a book one these models :-)

BR
Eskil
CALIBRE44
Posts: 136
Joined: Fri Jan 22, 2010 6:31 pm
Location: Florida

Re: RESEARCH PROJECT: BELT/RYDER REVOLVERS

Post by CALIBRE44 »

Thank you............Added to the list, every addition helps............Jim
PedroPete
Posts: 4
Joined: Mon Jun 18, 2018 5:13 am

Re: RESEARCH PROJECT: BELT/RYDER REVOLVERS

Post by PedroPete »

Hi Jim,
I was unable to PM, as I am a newby.
If you are still gathering info, there are good pics of a Belt, SA, .38RF,
3 line address (3rd line very light), matching S/Ns,
6 1/2 in, nickel, wood grips, no fluting, no engraving. blade sight, at
https://www.riverjunction.com/4843
I suspect that link will not be good for long, as the gun has sold.

The S/N is 80 58 (spaced as shown, both under barrel, and inside grip frame), with the cylinder stamped 245.
Inside rt grip panel the numbers 8058 are in pencil, difficult to make out, but seem to be spaced closely.
In the past few days I have been introduced to the frustration of making sense of these numbers.
I have read in various places that more belt were produced than Rider, and that more Rider were produced than belt.
And estimates that seem to put the combined total around 8000.
The serial number, if 8058, would be higher than those estimates..
But I also ran across an (old) auction listing with a 9xxx number.
I have read that the conversions had a second number stamped, sometimes ahead of the original number, raising the possibility the 80 and 58 in this case are separate numbers. I am skeptical of that, as I have also read that the spacing on the numbers was not uniform.
I am also unclear as to whether some belt factory conversions were to .38CF or if all were RF.

Hope the data on this revolver helps your effort, and if you can speculate on it or point me to any data you think is reliable, please share.

Regards,
-pete
Last edited by PedroPete on Mon Jun 18, 2018 3:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
CALIBRE44
Posts: 136
Joined: Fri Jan 22, 2010 6:31 pm
Location: Florida

Re: RESEARCH PROJECT: BELT/RYDER REVOLVERS

Post by CALIBRE44 »

PedroPete: Thank you for your addition.
All Belt models, SA or DA (Rider) share the same serial numbers. They were .36 percussion or .38rf cartridge. Standard barrel length was 61/2", however I have a few Belt models with shorter barrels. Serial numbers started in 1863 with #1 and the highest number so far is a Belt SA with 10022. ..............Jim
PedroPete
Posts: 4
Joined: Mon Jun 18, 2018 5:13 am

Re: RESEARCH PROJECT: BELT/RYDER REVOLVERS

Post by PedroPete »

Jim: Much thanks for the info.
Able to pm now, btw. -pete
Little_BigMan
Posts: 6
Joined: Fri Aug 03, 2018 3:24 pm

Re: RESEARCH PROJECT: BELT/RYDER REVOLVERS

Post by Little_BigMan »

I'm trying to find a couple of things out about the Remington Rider Belt Revolver (.36) produced between 1863, and I think about 1873, as follows: 1) I assume it was double/single action (not just DA only) based on descriptions I have seen about surviving models, true?; 2) About when, in 1863, was Remington turning this model out for sale? If anyone can assist with that information it is greatly appreciated! A good day to everyone.
Little_BigMan
Posts: 6
Joined: Fri Aug 03, 2018 3:24 pm

Re: RESEARCH PROJECT: BELT/RYDER REVOLVERS

Post by Little_BigMan »

So again, just curious, but the following is from a gun dealer ad for a Remington-Rider Belt Revolver in .36 cal. (Model 1863):

"The double-action mechanism works perfectly. The action is crisp and works very well in both single and double action modes."

But people are saying that the DA model was DA only. Was it functional in both SA and DA, but not recommended for firing in SA? I understand that the lock-work was different, but would it have prevented it from being fired in SA, or was it just not recommended (which would seem strange)? I'm just a little bewildered.
Thanks! LBM
aardq
Posts: 285
Joined: Sun Mar 13, 2005 1:02 pm

Re: RESEARCH PROJECT: BELT/RYDER REVOLVERS

Post by aardq »

Ho LBM,

The DA can be fired as a SA, but I have read, and been told that the design was for smooth DA operation and that SA may cause problems with the lockwork. Can't cite a source, but when you try a DA in DA and then try it in SA, the SA pull is anything but smooth, and the hammer doesn't always fall. At least taht's the way that my DAs work. I don't know the reason for this, but it is enough to reinforce what I've been told about using the DAs in DA only.

I await the real experts to chime in and set us on the path of truth!

Dan
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