Loads for antique brass shells

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dieNusse1
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Loads for antique brass shells

Post by dieNusse1 »

I have a bunch of antique 12 GA brass shells which I use to load black powder rounds. The shells have various makers marks (UMC, Winchester, Kynoch, Climax etc.) and seem to have the same internal volume and configuration. All are 2 5/8" in length. I've toyed with the idea of smokeless loads over the years but haven't found any loading data for modern powders.

I know that there is at least one modern load as I have a case of unfired rounds of Ducks Unlimited brass shells produced by Remington some 15 - 20 years ago.

Any help out there? Thanks in advance.
Researcher
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Re: Loads for antique brass shells

Post by Researcher »

I'm sure smokeless loads for brass shells could be done with today's powders, but for some reason back in the day, many gun maker's catalogues carried a warning like the first sentence here when they gave suggested loads --

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We certainly have no shortage of the Remington (right) and Winchester (left) all brass 00 buck loads made for the military during the Viet Nam war and later --

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dieNusse1
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Re: Loads for antique brass shells

Post by dieNusse1 »

Thanks for the info. I didn't know about the brass OO shells from Nam. I have several OO military rounds from that era but they are Federal plastic or paper.
paul harm
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Re: Loads for antique brass shells

Post by paul harm »

I tried loading brass shells with nitro - never had any luck. I too have the DU shells with the Remington name on them. Could someone contact Remington and ask who made them ? I to would like to have a nitro load.
paul harm
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Re: Loads for antique brass shells

Post by paul harm »

I just opened up one of my DU shells. There's a 1 1/4oz of shot, 1/8" OP card, a plastic wad with no shot cup that fits tight, another 1/8" OP card, and 37grs of a ball powder with a greenish tint. All wads fit very tight and with the slight roll crimp is probably how it gets it's pressure. Has anyone seen a powder I've described ? What powder would use 37grs behind a 1 1/4oz of shot ? Just looked at some PB - it's maybe a touch finer - the PD is black.
dieNusse1
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Re: Loads for antique brass shells

Post by dieNusse1 »

Just checked my loading data and the heaviest loads I've used are 33 grs of HS-6 and 28.5 grs of 4756 to push 1 1/4oz, The heaviest load I have on file for PB is 21 grs to push 1/1/8oz.

I tried Remington about 5 years ago but haven't received an answer but maybe someone else will have better luck.
paul harm
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Re: Loads for antique brass shells

Post by paul harm »

I final looked on the bottom of the box - it says " made in Brazil " - so it's a foreign powder and I'll never know. I tried Magtechs with 30grs of PB, fiber wads, and 1 1/8oz of shot, glued in OS card and was still getting bloopers so I quit. Maybe the slight roll crimp on the DU shells helps with pressure.
2shooter
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Re: Loads for antique brass shells

Post by 2shooter »

Ok. guys I have been shooting brass shells for twenty years or more. I load smokeless or black powder. Ten gauge 2 1/2 to 2 7/8 in black 1f or 2ff 3 1/2 drs 1 1/4 oz. shot In 12 ga. 3drs to 3 1/4 1 to 1 1/4 shot There are some things you need to do to the shells or they will split crack. You have to anneal the cases. I made sizing and crimping dies. You use 2 or 3 9 ga card over powder 2 felt wads then another card check space for shot and over shot wad you want it just in top case. Then you crimp case like the factory losds you have I write the load on top wad. Use 9 ga. wads for 10 ga. 11 ga. for 12 ga. wads. any ??? call me I shoot smokeless brass also.
dieNusse1
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Re: Loads for antique brass shells

Post by dieNusse1 »

I too have loaded BP for at least 20 years in both brass and plastic cases. I've always used the equal volume method for measuring powder & shot.

So Garland, what do you use for SP loads?
2shooter
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Re: Loads for antique brass shells

Post by 2shooter »

In my 12 ga. brass use 20 grs. Green Dot 1 I/8 oz shot and 24.5 grs. 7625 I like PB but Can't find any word is they stop making it. I only shoot 10 ga. in black now, many years back I shot smokeless. check loads and gun before shooting be safe. take one of D U cases check it with a magnet if it is brass or steel.
dieNusse1
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Re: Loads for antique brass shells

Post by dieNusse1 »

Thanks for the info on 7625. What was your load for PB? I still have a couple pounds of PB around.

Any suggestions concerning wad pressure?
paul harm
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Re: Loads for antique brass shells

Post by paul harm »

I to am interested in nito loads for 12ga brass shells. All my efforts were bloopers. I always thought it was because there wasn't enough resistance with the crimp seeing how I was just gluing in a OS .028 card. Are you crimping the brass ? I stopped trying with 30grs of PB and 1oz of shot. How many OS cards are you using ? Any help would be gratefully appreciated.
dieNusse1
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Re: Loads for antique brass shells

Post by dieNusse1 »

I've always heard or been under the impression that the volume of brass shells was much larger than plastic and that was a factor in loading SP loads. While that may be true, I would think that enough wadding at proper wad pressure plus a good roll crimp should be the solution.

Another factor that I haven't seen mentioned is interior configuration. In my experience the primer vent hole in a plastic hull sets in a recess while antique brass hulls have the vent hole in a tit located above the bottom. This means that ALL the powder is ABOVE the vent hole in plastic rounds while SOME of the powder is BELOW the vent hole in brass rounds. Given the volume of SP is less than BP, the placement of SP may not be the best for proper ignition. In fact, the OP wad might block the vent hole enough to result in poor ignition and poof ---

One solution might be to place a wad with a hole in it to raise the bottom before adding powder. Then the added powder would then be above the vent hole.

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