Blackhills or Hunters rifle ?

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blackhills
Posts: 43
Joined: Mon Aug 31, 2009 6:16 am

Blackhills or Hunters rifle ?

Post by blackhills » Mon Aug 31, 2009 2:45 pm

Hello,first post.I have a couple of questions about
a rolling block sporter I have ,ser#70xx all matching.It has a 28"round barrel(remington rollmark),octagon receiver,
sporter butt,not tapped for tang sight.It seems to conform with a blackhills rifle,but it is in 45/70 and so marked on barrel.It also has proofmarks on top of barrel near rollmark,an HP like an intertwined colt auto barrel and a V,but it could be an A.Has anyone observed these proofs before on a sporter?
Is it a Blackhills or Hunters rifle? Thanks for any
information. Bob

marlinman93
Posts: 124
Joined: Sat Aug 14, 2004 10:47 pm

Re: Blackhills or Hunters rifle ?

Post by marlinman93 » Mon Aug 31, 2009 8:21 pm

I suppose nothing is impossible, but the catalogs listed the Black Hills Sporters as .45-60 bottleneck. Your configuration sounds correct, but the caliber isn't the one listed. May still be OK, if there's no sign of rechambering or barrel being set back.

blackhills
Posts: 43
Joined: Mon Aug 31, 2009 6:16 am

Re: Blackhills or Hunters rifle ?

Post by blackhills » Tue Sep 01, 2009 5:58 am

Marlinman93, thanks for reply.The barrel measures
exactly 28",and chamber appears original.Does anyone know if the hunters rifle
was tapped for a tang sight?
Man it's really hard to find out much about these
number one sporters,they really are rare.I have the new book coming.Maybe it will answer some questions. Thanks, Bob

oldremguy
Posts: 143
Joined: Sun Jun 29, 2003 8:53 am
Location: Rochester, NY

Re: Blackhills or Hunters rifle ?

Post by oldremguy » Tue Sep 01, 2009 5:32 pm

In the book by Roy Marcot " Remington Rolling Block Rifles, Carbines & Shotguns, Sporting & Target Rifles, he writes about the Black Hills Sporting Rifles. They were made in two styles, using the round military receiver and the octagon receiver found on the sporting model. The rifles made with the military receiver did not have a serial number stamped on it like the sporting receiver model. The three sporting model guns serial numbers that were listed in the book ranged from 7000 to 7700. All three of the rifles built using the sporting reciever were chambered in 45-60, the one gun in the book built with the military receiver was chambered in 45-70.

Have a good day,
Matt

blackhills
Posts: 43
Joined: Mon Aug 31, 2009 6:16 am

Re: Blackhills or Hunters rifle ?

Post by blackhills » Wed Sep 09, 2009 5:21 am

To those interested,I got Roy Marcots new book,
and I guess what I have is a # 1 sporter with a 28" round barrel.I'm still curious about the proof marks.
Thanks, Bob

oldremguy
Posts: 143
Joined: Sun Jun 29, 2003 8:53 am
Location: Rochester, NY

Re: Blackhills or Hunters rifle ?

Post by oldremguy » Tue Nov 17, 2009 9:29 pm

Hello Bob,

Can you post any photos of your rifle; l would like to see the markings that are on your barrel. I mainly collect military rolling block rifles, but have three sporting rifles. Two of the sporting rifles have octagon barrels, the third one is a Creedmoor Musket with a round barrel. None of my sporting rifle have the HP stamped on them like is encountered on the military rifles and carbines. All I can think of is that your rifle was in with a bunch of military rifles and the inspector seen that it had a round barrel like all the rest of the military rifles that he was proof testing and put the HP stamping on your barrel.

The Creedmoor rifle that I have, has the serial number stamped on barrel, forearm, buttstock, butt plate and even the nose cap like is found on all of the sporting rifles, kind of cool. Does your rifle have the serial number stamped on all of its parts. I see in Roy Marcot book that some of the sporting rifles were made using the round military barrels. May be you have a military barrel on your gun. Your rifle could be one of the midrange target models shown on page 177, in Roy’s book. Sorry I can’t help you out to much, don’t know a lot about the sporting rifles.

Have a good day,
Matt

blackhills
Posts: 43
Joined: Mon Aug 31, 2009 6:16 am

Re: Blackhills or Hunters rifle ?

Post by blackhills » Wed Nov 18, 2009 5:04 am

Hello Matt. Thanks for reply.I just got a new camera setup and haven't quite figured it out yet.
I will try to get some images up this weekend.
The proof marks are Hp (intertwined) on one side of Remington rollmark and the V is on the other
side.
The serial # 707x is on all parts including the barrel,all wood, nose cap, buttplate.There is not a serial# on the front of the frame and the butt stock I don't believe has ever been off,so l'm going to leave it alone.This is really a nice rifle,
and would like to know more about it.
Bob

blackhills
Posts: 43
Joined: Mon Aug 31, 2009 6:16 am

Re: Blackhills or Hunters rifle ?

Post by blackhills » Tue Nov 24, 2009 9:47 am

Still working on camera.Thought I would add this info.
This rifle only weights 7 pounds and has some odd sling swivels that I am sure are not original,but have been on there a long time.It has that Black hills rear sight,as in the book,pg 94,it has all the same features(looks just like it) except it has the forend nose cap and is 45/70 and those proofmarks on barrel. Bob


blackhills
Posts: 43
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Re: Blackhills or Hunters rifle ?

Post by blackhills » Thu Jan 14, 2010 6:07 am

Hello guys.I'm going to bump this up as I'm begining to think this is a rare rifle. Has anyone seen a
similar rifle with these proofs. Thanks, Bob

marlinman93
Posts: 124
Joined: Sat Aug 14, 2004 10:47 pm

Re: Blackhills or Hunters rifle ?

Post by marlinman93 » Sun Feb 28, 2010 10:36 pm

Any way to get a little better picture of the proof marks? More straight on, instead of the slight angle of the existing pics?
The rifle itself doesn't look all that different than many Rolling Block Sporting models I've seen, but I believe it has been overseas at some time in it's life, and the proof marks may telll us which country it went to.-Vall

blackhills
Posts: 43
Joined: Mon Aug 31, 2009 6:16 am

Re: Blackhills or Hunters rifle ?

Post by blackhills » Mon Mar 01, 2010 3:45 am

Marlinman, thanks for reply.That image was the best one I could get.The HP is kind of a weak strike and on a round surface just doesn't show very well.
The HP is similar to the ones NYS rifles have under the barrel band.My son has a new Dino-Lite camera set up,but we can't seem to get the lighting right.
I will keep you posted. Bob

marlinman93
Posts: 124
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Re: Blackhills or Hunters rifle ?

Post by marlinman93 » Tue Mar 02, 2010 3:51 pm

I'm looking at my copy of George LAyman's new book on military Rolling Blocks, but don't se any reference to a "HP" marking anywhere on the New York rifles. He does mention a inspector's mark of "HBH" located on the forearm, and other places. Also a "GH" and "RPB", but no "HP".???

blackhills
Posts: 43
Joined: Mon Aug 31, 2009 6:16 am

Re: Blackhills or Hunters rifle ?

Post by blackhills » Tue Mar 02, 2010 5:00 pm

Marlinman.I checked my NYS rifle and it has an H And a P, not interlaced, and a V under the third barrel band from the end.My memory is not what it used to be.I will post some images soon. Bob

blackhills
Posts: 43
Joined: Mon Aug 31, 2009 6:16 am

Re: Blackhills or Hunters rifle ?

Post by blackhills » Fri Aug 13, 2010 5:50 am

Hello guys.
I found a carbine on Gunbroker #183738420 that has a simular proof on top
of the barrel.It has the "V" proof and a "P"
but not the interlaced "HP" which is on my rifle.It's the closest marking i've found. Bob

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