New Guy and SURPRISE! I have a "ID my RB" question

Topics related to Pre - 1898 Remington Rifles
millsan1
Posts: 13
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2019 10:22 am

New Guy and SURPRISE! I have a "ID my RB" question

Post by millsan1 » Fri Feb 08, 2019 10:32 am

I have a friend, whose Father In Law passed.

He had a lot of firearms and my friend sold most of them to a dealer.

A few wall hangers came back for being non functional, one of them a Remington RB.

I am trying to ID it for him, and this forum is one I came across with the best chance.

I will tell you all I know.

It appears to be a Model 1 with a rotary extractor.

It has "N Y A" in a triangle on the right side.

It has the safety feature of the Army and NY models where when the rolling block is opened, and then closed, the hammer will not fire, and you must recock it slightly.

There are no serial numbers anywhere, except on the left tang, under the butt stock # is 2XXX. I believe this indicates a build lot, rather than a serial number, from what I read, but clearly can be wrong.

The Manufacturer is "Remingtons" not Remington nor Remington and Sons. I can't find anythign related to that.

I do not have a full picture at the moment, but here is what I see
IMG_20190208_084037.jpg
IMG_20190208_084037.jpg (3.28 MiB) Viewed 1386 times
IMG_20190208_084108.jpg
IMG_20190208_084108.jpg (2.86 MiB) Viewed 1386 times
IMG_20190208_084033.jpg
IMG_20190208_084033.jpg (2.86 MiB) Viewed 1386 times
IMG_20190208_084029.jpg
IMG_20190208_084029.jpg (3.19 MiB) Viewed 1386 times
IMG_20190208_084018.jpg
IMG_20190208_084018.jpg (3.63 MiB) Viewed 1386 times

millsan1
Posts: 13
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2019 10:22 am

Re: New Guy and SURPRISE! I have a "ID my RB" question

Post by millsan1 » Fri Feb 08, 2019 12:23 pm

A few more pics
IMG_20190208_084006.jpg
IMG_20190208_084006.jpg (3.65 MiB) Viewed 1381 times
IMG_20190208_084049.jpg
IMG_20190208_084049.jpg (3.8 MiB) Viewed 1381 times
IMG_20190207_221833.jpg
IMG_20190207_221833.jpg (3.88 MiB) Viewed 1381 times
Last edited by millsan1 on Fri Feb 08, 2019 12:31 pm, edited 2 times in total.

millsan1
Posts: 13
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2019 10:22 am

Re: New Guy and SURPRISE! I have a "ID my RB" question

Post by millsan1 » Fri Feb 08, 2019 12:25 pm

IMG_20190207_221811.jpg
IMG_20190207_221811.jpg (3.19 MiB) Viewed 1382 times
The "Remingtons" part

millsan1
Posts: 13
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2019 10:22 am

Re: New Guy and SURPRISE! I have a "ID my RB" question

Post by millsan1 » Fri Feb 08, 2019 12:27 pm

One more item of detail.

The cleaning rod screws into a flat plate in the action. The flat plate kind of floats in two grooves.

oldremguy
Posts: 188
Joined: Sun Jun 29, 2003 8:53 am
Location: Rochester, NY

Re: New Guy and SURPRISE! I have a "ID my RB" question

Post by oldremguy » Fri Feb 08, 2019 12:45 pm

It's a New York State Model rolling block rifle.
Here is a photo of some of them that I had on display at a gun show.
Page_11.jpg
Page_11.jpg (410.71 KiB) Viewed 1377 times

Have a Good Day,
Matt

wlw-19958
Posts: 83
Joined: Sun Sep 18, 2016 7:21 pm

Re: New Guy and SURPRISE! I have a "ID my RB" question

Post by wlw-19958 » Fri Feb 08, 2019 1:00 pm

Hi There,

I don't know exactly what you have. The tang markings
are the typical Remington military contract type. It is
probably part of the New York State Militia contract but the
tang markings are not typical (the first contract had patent
dates ending in 1871 and the second contract had patent
dates ending in 1874). It is unusual that a action ending with
1866 pat. date has the "safety" action and rotary extractor.

This may have been made for some other State militia under
contract but the "NY A" leads one to think it has something to
do with New York.

Have you established the caliber yet? It would be interesting
to examine the stock for any cartouches and/or stampings on
the metal. Some more pics of the rifle showing rear sight and
barrel length would be helpful too.

Good Luck!
-Blue Chips-
Webb

millsan1
Posts: 13
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2019 10:22 am

Re: New Guy and SURPRISE! I have a "ID my RB" question

Post by millsan1 » Fri Feb 08, 2019 1:39 pm

Thanks for the info.

I did disassemble the gun last night.

I did not take enough pictures.

Under the rear barrel band (I am sure that isn't the right term), there is a mark. I want to say a "P".

There is also another mark, RPP or RBP or something to that affect. I will look for it tonight and post more pictures.

I will also get measurements and post.

I do not know caliber. No markings of any kind on the barrel or action related to that.

I literally got this in my hands last night and spent 3 or 4 hours just taking it apart, examining the functions and thinking about the history of the piece. Up until 16 hours ago or so, I had no interest in an RB rifle, and now I really want to keep this one. I want to bring it back to shooter condition, so the history of the piece will include me for a time.

I want to buy this from my friend, but I really do not know value and I do not want to lowball him. I want to give him fair value of the piece.

millsan1
Posts: 13
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2019 10:22 am

Re: New Guy and SURPRISE! I have a "ID my RB" question

Post by millsan1 » Fri Feb 08, 2019 1:41 pm

oldremguy wrote:
Fri Feb 08, 2019 12:45 pm
It's a New York State Model rolling block rifle.
Here is a photo of some of them that I had on display at a gun show.




Have a Good Day,
Matt
Thank you. Were they all 50/70?

oldremguy
Posts: 188
Joined: Sun Jun 29, 2003 8:53 am
Location: Rochester, NY

Re: New Guy and SURPRISE! I have a "ID my RB" question

Post by oldremguy » Fri Feb 08, 2019 2:06 pm

Most were made in 50-70, some of the later ones that may of been purchased by individual National Guard members were chambered in 45-70.
Page_10.jpg
Page_10.jpg (477.72 KiB) Viewed 1367 times
The very first New York State model rolling block rifles were made with the last patent dated ending in 1866 on the upper tang. The safety feature that drops the hammer after the breech block is closed used a 1871 patent. Some of the first rifles don't have this date stamped on the upper tang. Remington stamped a few of the rifles with this dated on the bottom of the lower tang, before putting the 1871 date on the upper tang. I will post a photo of the 1871 date on the lower tang tonight.

Have a Good Day,
Matt

wlw-19958
Posts: 83
Joined: Sun Sep 18, 2016 7:21 pm

Re: New Guy and SURPRISE! I have a "ID my RB" question

Post by wlw-19958 » Fri Feb 08, 2019 3:52 pm

Hi There,
oldremguy wrote:The very first New York State model rolling block rifles were made with the last patent dated ending in 1866 on the upper tang. The safety feature that drops the hammer after the breech block is closed used a 1871 patent. Some of the first rifles don't have this date stamped on the upper tang. Remington stamped a few of the rifles with this dated on the bottom of the lower tang, before putting the 1871 date on the upper tang.


This is good to know. George Layman's book didn't cover this
and I will add this to my information. It is good to have people
with specific knowledge who are willing to share and broaden
the base.

Good Luck!
-Blue Chips-
Webb

oldremguy
Posts: 188
Joined: Sun Jun 29, 2003 8:53 am
Location: Rochester, NY

Re: New Guy and SURPRISE! I have a "ID my RB" question

Post by oldremguy » Fri Feb 08, 2019 10:00 pm

Here is a photo of the 1871 Patent date stamped on the lower tang of my rifle. Sorry for the poor quality of the photo it was taken about 15 years ago. I will try to take a better photo in the up coming days. It reads
PATD AUG 27th 1867
NOV 7th 1871
NYS3a.jpg
NYS3a.jpg (64.38 KiB) Viewed 1354 times
Have a Good Day,
Matt

millsan1
Posts: 13
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2019 10:22 am

Re: New Guy and SURPRISE! I have a "ID my RB" question

Post by millsan1 » Sat Feb 09, 2019 10:55 pm

Sadly,. O such markings on mine. Went to a gun show today and a RB expert had no guess, but he pointed me at another guy who might know.

I am now on a mission to figure out this gun's history.

millsan1
Posts: 13
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2019 10:22 am

Re: New Guy and SURPRISE! I have a "ID my RB" question

Post by millsan1 » Sun Feb 10, 2019 11:24 am

Some measurements. Gun is 42" long, from tip of barrel to end 0f butt stock

Barrel is 25" long

Forestock is 21" long

Stock is 13.5"

IMG_20190210_112828.jpg
IMG_20190210_112828.jpg (285.53 KiB) Viewed 1315 times
IMG_20190210_112837.jpg
IMG_20190210_112837.jpg (544.79 KiB) Viewed 1315 times
IMG_20190210_112854.jpg
IMG_20190210_112854.jpg (454.53 KiB) Viewed 1315 times
IMG_20190210_112917.jpg
IMG_20190210_112917.jpg (337.67 KiB) Viewed 1315 times

millsan1
Posts: 13
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2019 10:22 am

Re: New Guy and SURPRISE! I have a "ID my RB" question

Post by millsan1 » Sun Feb 10, 2019 11:25 am

Pic of the entire gun

Proof mark? under the rear barrel band

Marks on barrel bands

IMG_20190210_112906.jpg
IMG_20190210_112906.jpg (447.41 KiB) Viewed 1315 times
IMG_20190210_112515.jpg
IMG_20190210_112515.jpg (331.41 KiB) Viewed 1315 times
IMG_20190210_112424.jpg
IMG_20190210_112424.jpg (298.73 KiB) Viewed 1315 times
IMG_20190210_112355.jpg
IMG_20190210_112355.jpg (347.74 KiB) Viewed 1315 times
IMG_20190210_112406.jpg
IMG_20190210_112406.jpg (313.81 KiB) Viewed 1315 times

millsan1
Posts: 13
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2019 10:22 am

Re: New Guy and SURPRISE! I have a "ID my RB" question

Post by millsan1 » Sun Feb 10, 2019 11:28 am

Proof mark? Near butt end of barrel, near action

Hammer height

Breach face

Front sight
IMG_20190210_112533.jpg
IMG_20190210_112533.jpg (306.52 KiB) Viewed 1315 times
IMG_20190210_112933.jpg
IMG_20190210_112933.jpg (392.45 KiB) Viewed 1315 times
IMG_20190210_112947.jpg
IMG_20190210_112947.jpg (284.88 KiB) Viewed 1315 times
IMG_20190210_113221.jpg
IMG_20190210_113221.jpg (283.19 KiB) Viewed 1315 times
IMG_20190210_113233.jpg
IMG_20190210_113233.jpg (200.97 KiB) Viewed 1315 times

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest